Greg Voisen
Welcome back to Inside Personal Growth. This is Greg Voisen host of Inside Personal Growth. And joining me at a Mexico and where are you actually in Mexico?

Brad Axelrad
Just a little bit outside of Playa Del Carmen towards to loom.

Greg Voisen
So a beautiful part of the world. And I'm here in Encinitas. As most of my listeners know, I haven't changed locations and as long as I can remember, but it's bad. Brad x red. And Brad has basically a website, which I want to direct everybody to called face your dragon.com. Brad is an author but more an author of podcasts. Not particularly a book. Is that correct? I'm right.

Brad Axelrad
I've been published in two books that weren't mine and two anthology books, but not my own book,

Greg Voisen
right. But he's still an author, and he is a coach. And he helps people with these five dragons. I'm going to say a little bit about him. I've known him for quite some time. We reconnected here. Most recently, when he was back up in Newport Beach. He produces a podcast show, and we were just speaking about that. And he's had some of the bestselling business owners thought leaders, authors coaches on such as Janet John SRF, Bob Proctor, Don Miguel Ruiz, Gay Hendricks, Ali Brown, Michael Gerber and more. He's also a founding member of at L sociation. of transformative leaders, and a co-founder of ATL Costa Rica, founded in 2017, he spends most of his time helping people, I would say, coaching them, and you will go to his website, and you're gonna see a pop up for free download. There, you can also check out his website, or I should say, his podcast, or all the people that he's worked with. And doing that, I would highly recommend that you go do that. You can schedule a free call with Brad, there's a big button right there. Just click that button and schedule a call with him. And today, we're going to be talking about this. Well, he's got a free paper that you can download. But we're going to be talking about these dragons that are in everybody's life, everybody out there. So Brad, welcome to Inside personal growth. Let's just kick it off. And you can give us a little sneak peek into the five dragons, and how they really kind of shaped your journey because you say right in here, you are as free to anybody about public speaking in it as anybody could get when you started out, but you've overcome that fear. And there's a lot of people that are afraid of public speaking.

Greg Voisen
Me too. That's why I use a podcast. It's a hell of one.

Brad Axelrad
And that's all safer.

Greg Voisen
Yeah, did that taper?

Brad Axelrad
Well, yeah, you want me to jump in?

Greg Voisen
Yeah, I do. That's awesome. Yeah, the question was, how is it kind of how these dragons kind of shaped your own journey?

Brad Axelrad
Look, you know, public speaking is the number one fear above dying. I still have it, you said I actually overcame the fear of public speaking and I haven't, I still get nervous, I still get excited. And as the founder of Gestalt therapy said, Fear is excitement without the breath. So we so oftentimes forget to breathe. And when we're having these exciting moments, not fearful moments, we breathe and we and we use that energy to fuel our purpose to fuel our message to project our voice out in the world to serve and it's not so much about slaying your dragon more about facing it and using the energy of your shadow into your great work in the world. And that's kind of how I came up with facial dragon I first heard about it years ago from Joseph Campbell, the creator of the hero's journey, and I heard him say you got to face your dragon so that's good and he went on and shared all about it the shadow and so that's really good. It never left me. But as you said, I came up with five main fears and we can dive into them but the they're at the simplest level, it's imposter, scarcity, value unheard and critics and these are running all of us at some level. They're running me and all the businesses I've started and co founded or founded and you know as business owners or speakers or authors or coaches We, we, we put ourselves selves out there and we bump into these, but we can dive into more. But that's it in a nutshell.

Greg Voisen
Well, you know, you talk about the shadow and you know, it was a big one on that was Ariel Ford SR ease live in La Jolla. And she wrote a lot about shadows and she had her own shadow because she finally ended up actually exiting this world. In not the way you'd want somebody to exit, which was an overdose. And the interesting thing was, is she had written about those shadows for some time. So it's interesting, you bring it up, because you had Arielle on the podcast. Yeah. And, and obviously, she addresses that as well, because her sister had quite an influence on her. So talk with us about you said there's five of them. Let's talk about it. Because your podcast has kind of been a source of inspiration when you look at all the people that are on here. You know, Barnett Bain, who worked with Robin Williams, and I've interviewed and he talks about the doing the conundrum of doing and being that's his big thing. What was the catalyst that led you to start and how does it connect with these five dragon concepts?

Brad Axelrad
Yeah, Barnett's is one of the most brilliant humans I just or Barnett, he's amazing. I mean, he produced what dreams may come with Robin Williams, which is my favorite movie years ago and self esteem prophecy the movie, which is another favorite book by Steven Read, read read Redford. I just forgot

Greg Voisen
his read for and then he did. The one about the limit. He didn't own the

Brad Axelrad
secret which was Yeah, Eckhart Tolle is children's book and he's just a just a fabulous brilliant soul. Sol you know, recognizing that we have these pains and challenges and fears and shadows. And I think actually, I don't know that that Debbie for died of an overdose. I for some reason, thought she had cancer. I maybe

Greg Voisen
I could have been, you know, if I was mistaken. Yeah. But she did have a problem with alcohol and drugs. Okay, maybe it wasn't an overdose in the end. But her sister had said to me that my sister has had an amazing challenge with that. That's a shadow. Yeah, right.

Brad Axelrad
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Yeah. So the shadow is there lurking to serve us if we're willing to turn the light on. I'll never forget. That's what Barnett said in the in the facial dragon podcast. But, you know, my work started at the Hoffman Institute, I became the Orange County, California graduate facilitator for the Hoffman process way back in 2005. And that, and Debbie Ford birth, the shadow concept and the shadow effect or whatever it was called from the Hoffman process. That's where it came from. So I was the Orange County grab graduate facilitator, leading these groups of graduates and guiding them through for several years, coaching them to deepen the Hoffman work in their life. And after a while, I thought, you know, it's kind of kind of, I really want to take this conversation outside of the Hoffman work and move into more quantum physics and neuroscience in the law of attraction and anything else that was sort of present then. And, you know, within, you know, it started after my dad died, like that was the genesis of me finally saying, I'm ready to be in contribution, I need to be in service. That's the only thing that's going to fill up this for lack of better terms, God sized hole that they use in addiction circles, so that I could be in contribution, because self-indulgence wasn't working anymore. And my father had passed, I needed something deeper to be in contribution. So I started the Hoffman graduate sort of circles. And then, like I said, I moved fast forward a couple years started producing the events. And within eight weeks, we manifested NBC Nightly News and PBS television and USC news and LA Times Orange County Register all these things. So there was this big groundswell happening watching my purpose surface. And as I was doing it, I was noticing all of the dragons that were kind of present for me, like who am I to be doing this, the imposter syndrome was just screaming at me. I'm standing on stage on national media at on getting interviewed. I'm like, Wow, I'm relatively new to this. I've been leading transformation for like three years, who am I to be doing this, but who are so not to be doing it? That's right. Yeah. So that's it. So they that's where it sort of started and then, you know, fast forward, I've produced a couple of 100 live events since then, and, you know, as you'd mentioned, for almost 15 years, a founding member of the association of transformational leaders, with people like Miguel Ruiz, and Barnett Bain and men, Arielle, and lots of other people like that. And I still have these dragons that show up imposter scarcity value unheard and critics they still learn work there definitely a little less but that's kind of the genesis of it and launched the podcast because I wanted to interview all my friends like you know Miguel Ruiz was guest number one of the Four Agreements Gay Hendricks guests. Number two Christine Carlson from don't sweat the small stuff number three. Barnett was number four I had JP Sears,

Greg Voisen
how can you have Jack on?

Brad Axelrad
Never had Jack? I didn't I need to get jack on but I did one season and pause that I got pulled into this really beautiful blockchain platform that we're building and that pause the podcast and I, one of these days, I'll fire up season two, but I haven't yet.

Greg Voisen
Well, you know, it's a great podcast for people to go to, you know, you've had some really good guests and high quality interviews. And let's talk about that. Because, you know, I said right in the middle of that, who were you not to be doing that Hoffman program? And the ego? Because let's get to it. Because the reality is, we all know that the ego is there for two reasons. One, a lot of times it says we're not enough. And you could say, okay, well, it's there to protect us. But we could talk about ego for a long time. The key is not the fact that the ego was telling you weren't enough, and you were an imposter. And you doubted yourself. It was what you did, to make amends with the ego. Right? Yeah. To live comfortably with that. So what did you do because you kept doing those Hoffman programs, and no one said anything?

Brad Axelrad
Yeah, well, I wasn't referencing the imposter syndrome. When I was leading the Hoffman process. It's when I when I stepped away from that and started manifesting all the major media outlets, and was, you know, a leader of a large community that I had created. And it was amazing to have people like Pat Finn as the hosts of well as the host and first speaker of our community's grand opening event. And pad just, I mean, Pat's amazing, you know, he's dear friends with Michael Beckwith At agape and was the host of the California Lottery, big spin TV show, and Joker's wild and shop till you drop. And he was a landmark forum teacher, like, wow, who am I to be standing next to these titans of transformation as a leader and you know, what I had to do we step in, so the shadow surfaces for us, but it really is our friend, like you were just saying, we, we don't want to slay our dragon, we want to turn the light on in the in the room where the dragons they're scared, and we turn the light on and it goes away. So we want to illuminate our shadow and make friends with it. And that's really what it's about. It's about loving our fear and loving our imposter syndrome, loving our scarcity dragon like that's, that's what it's about. It's about embracing these things, and transforming them into fuel, because that's really where all of our power lives is in the shadow.

Greg Voisen
Well, look, the subconscious mind is really, really controls a lot. And you and I both know that. And depending on how it was programmed, as Bruce Lipton said, You got to program it. So from ages one through seven, we were programming it. And we've been programming and still programming, the question is reprogramming. So in your experience, is there one dragon that most people struggle with? And if so, why? And what do you why do you think it is that dragon and out of those five that you've identified? I'm sure we could identify another 100 If we wanted, but what are what is it that people struggle with?

Brad Axelrad
You know, when I first was building this and downloading this and crafting it, and birth to get into the world, I thought for sure, it's imposter. And I still think that one's really high. But the more that I'm, you know, I've had this platform and this message crafted for probably eight years at this point. And I thought it was imposter but what I'm really realizing is that it's more scarcity. And scarcity shows up everywhere. It shows up in money in friendship and in just a bundle lack of abundance is literally everywhere, you know us we're we've got the world at our fingertips with computers and living in from the States and we were very blessed to be Americans in that sense, you know, but scarcity is everywhere, even in the wealthiest of areas. There's still this low level kind of never enoughness I'm never enough I'll never have enough money I'm gonna ruin everything and be poor again. I mean, whatever it is, like it's, it's running everybody, especially in the pandemic, that resurface that, you know, you can see people's behaviors of acting tough and strong and all these other ways that was all fear based. Everyone was really afraid and fear manifests. and shows up in all these different ways. And we try to overcompensate our lack of our lack of abundance. But I would say scarcity is really probably the most prevalent in all aspects.

Greg Voisen
Well, you know, brand, I would agree with you there. And I add to that, you know, recently Thomas Moore was on here, they wrote a book called the eloquence of silence, I think he's written like 23 books. Wow. And we started talking about we started talking about emptiness. Now, that's a Buddhist kind of philosophy, okay. But emptiness, again, if somebody's bucket is empty, our society doesn't like that, you got to go fill that up again. Whether it's, you know, people you want to talk to, or friends or money, or relationship, or cars, or houses, or whatever it is. It's not cool to have an empty bucket to sit in silence. You know, I just got back from a six day meditation retreat, I was two days in silence. Cool. But the cool thing is, is what you receive as a result of and that's where I'm going with this question with the shadow. Do you believe one of the biggest fears that people have because they don't want to address it is our own demise? Because in the Buddhist tradition, on one end is Buddha on the other end is a skeleton. And when you do a walking meditation, a monk will tell you, hey, Woody, there was a monk story there at the retreat, which I've heard many times a Rinpoche comes, says, Is there any I get 40? I want to get a watch. Great. What do you want to watch for? I want to remind myself, I'm going to set it because it has a timer on it. And every hour, the time is gonna go off. And it's gonna tell I'm one hour closer to death. And you think yourself, right? Do you want to reminder most people in this society, the Western culture, they don't embrace it. Now, I think it's a big fear. That's one of the biggest fears that we don't want to address is the fact that we're impermanent that the bucket can be empty. What would you say about that? I mean, you share a transformative story of someone who came face to face with their dragons. Maybe that's one of the biggest dragons and the guidance that kind of emerged to make them stronger.

Brad Axelrad
Yeah, there's so many so many ways to answer that in so many layers to all that you've shared I you know, I've been been studying Taoism for a very long time almost probably 25 years at this point and just appreciate the way of nature and and you know, what you're saying about about the emptiness there? And you know, but what's, what's crazy is the fear of public speaking is above that fear of death for most that's what I always find that so fascinating.

Greg Voisen
They do say that. Yes. Yeah,

Brad Axelrad
So boy, a story of somebody who's whose face their dragon I trying to think how to really frame that. I mean, what comes to mind is, for me is the fear of public speaking and how that became my greatest gift and my greatest contribution and having the courage to lean into that. And recognize, what I like to say on my podcast is what we're most resisting and most afraid of, are the very things that will set us free. It's our gift to humanity, or money maker and our purpose on the planet. So if there's something that you're really noticing fear and resistance to, that's where you need to go, like fear means go, if there's resistance, perfect, keep leaning in, you know, like, that's, that's where we're going to open up all the opportunities we've been seeking. So I'm just thinking of myself on my own personal hero's journey of coming through the despair, and then ultimately coming back with the Elixir. And the despair was, you know, as my, I watched my father take his last breath and 36 hours later being at the Hoffman process for the second time. And that wasn't planned. I just happened to end up there. And it was through that despair that I was able to recognize the beauty in the beauty and my pain, the beauty in my, in my, in my darkest days, that was the that was the biggest contribution that sprouted from that. So yeah. Um, but you know, I think

Greg Voisen
We, we do all of us struggle with that, whether it's fear of public speaking or, you know, you coming back, your father dying 36 hours later being involved in this. And what comes up for me is, is a something we used to say in the spiritual psychology course, you know, and this is a P Your this would actually be something that would be quite relevant to your dragons. One. You don't have to believe everything you think.

Brad Axelrad
Amen to that.

Greg Voisen
Two is and I remember Byron Katie. Yeah, you used to saying you've been on the show a couple of times.

Brad Axelrad
Cool. Is it great?

Greg Voisen
Is it true? Is it really true, right?

Brad Axelrad
you sure? Do you certain that's true? Yeah. Are you certain

Greg Voisen
it's true, right? She put people up on stage and you get them that Oh, I hate my partner. He's a bastard. Is that is that? Is that really true? They think about a little more right you know, you heard it all. My point is that's like the dragon isn't it? It's like slaying the dragon because in essence right now we've formulated a thought and we live in a world and making stuff up then to me begin to believe what we made up and then we have to undo what we made up that we were believing was right.

Brad Axelrad
Why let's laughing at our silly of just laughing at our silly human experience and how we get so programmed from church and from our childhood and from school and community and and culture and you know, we we we really are pulling from update seven, like you said, and that's really what Hoffman is goes in and sort of ferrets out and heals a lot of that childhood patterning and programming. Then then you lead from your spiritual essence it's such a beautiful process. I pray everybody checks it out at Hoffman. institute.org. It's just beautiful work. I'm not affiliated. Just please go look. And it's it's a I can't I can't help but laugh. There's such great power in us having the courage to face these programs and patterns, because that's that's it. We're just constantly being imprinted everywhere we go. The media, friends, church. Well,

Greg Voisen
I think I think Bruce Lipton said it the other day, like we the main, the matrix is real, you're going to take the red pill, the blue pill? The reality is you said quantum physics about five minutes ago. And on so what? Fiscal vibrational plane do we exist that we really believe? is here, you know, okay, yeah, I can bang on this desk. I may Adams in this desk. I can't put my fist through it. Right. But the reality is that I could have I was vibrating at a different level. Okay, probably. Yeah. Well, probably, probably to scientifically Yeah, we could

Brad Axelrad
scientifically you can. But I don't know. I don't know, that have figured out how to do that. Yeah, but

Greg Voisen
nobody that I know, maybe if they're an avatar, they could maybe do that you and I hate if power versus force. And the reality is, is that the Dalai Lama is it, you know, whatever level he's vibrating at great. But you know, you've won so many hats, you've been this self help area for a long time. And your five dragons has been around for a long time. What approach that you're taking makes this distinct and probably different, and maybe more effective than other methodologies that we might see someplace else. In other words, like you've got a program here, you've got a big website, you've got a podcast that you said, You paused, but you're going to bring it back. But this is at its core, is what you love to do. Right? Help people with us.

Brad Axelrad
Yeah so…

Greg Voisen
Forget the crypto coin thing, because that's gone.

Brad Axelrad
What sprouted from this and in recent weeks, and I think you'll appreciate this, Greg, you know, I've been been on about 15 podcasts in the last three weeks and and it's been this fun sort of push to get back out and share my message because like Jason Silva says, if you guys have ever seen who he is, man, amazing order, and channel, he just speaks these incredible flows. And you get to these flow states and speaks. But he says that if we're not sharing our message, in a way, it's like, it's like, there's this welling up and he's gonna burst if he doesn't get it out and actually, you know, serve people with what's coming through him and out of his mouth. And so what I mean by that is, and how it's manifested in the last couple of weeks is I'm finding that a lot of people want to share a message. And that's how I really started this whole platform. It's, you want to be a speaker, author, coach, event, producer, podcaster. Author, but you're, you're afraid and one of these things is keeping you from doing it. So you don't you don't get started or you started any stop, get started and you stop. So that was the initial sort of impetus and genesis of this brand. It's like I've seen so many people, including myself struggle, we start we stopped, we stopped, we stopped and we just don't do it. So that was the beginning of it. But what I Finding now is that most people are really ready to share a message. And they want to get on podcasts because to me, it's one of the best ways you know, producing the podcast is one thing, but getting on other people's audiences. I don't have to do any of the production, the editing, this social media, graphics, the promoting, you're doing all that Greg, and all these other podcasters are doing it for me that I am on. And they're creating all this content. So I had this brilliant idea because I figured out a system how to get people on podcasts. So face your dragon is the flagship sort of core offer of courage into clients, which is what I've been teaching for a long time. That's how to build a platform, build a message, overcome your fears, get your message out there. But get me on podcast.com. That's the new push that all of this encapsulates to get people out sharing their message, and on tons of podcasts. So that's, that's the new exciting push that we're up to now. Well, I

Greg Voisen
again, we've got, as you said, sitting there in Mexico, so much in the way of technology in our hands today. Yep. With the advent of AI, right. And the ability to distribute more of this in a different way. I think it's about sharing a message, I would agree, you've got a great message. I would also say it's about the assimilation of all these messages that we're receiving. Because social media is so prolific, and finding a commonality to do good in the world. It's one thing to listen to all this stuff. It's another thing to take action on all this stuff, and to be a good force for the world. Right. And so for the listeners who might be feeling a little apprehensive about facing some of their own dragons, right, it's going back to your dragons. What one piece of advice would you give, to embolden them? To really take a first step? Because sharing your message, okay, that's an action. Right? That's an action you sharing it on a podcast. But as you know, I turned this podcast into something for good, compassionate communication. Boy, you did. It's brilliant solving, helping solve a big, big problem that I can make a small dent in write, which is homelessness. I don't care what your I think Steven Kotler said this, to me about billion times been on here six or seven times. One thing he says is, he says, Brad, focus is for free. Okay, curiosity we all have. Turning a curiosity into purpose is the next thing and finding a deeper purpose for why you exist on the planet. Then from that purpose defining, okay, your your vision, your values, your goals, everything you need to do, but the process that he kind of identified from focus, to curiosity, to then purpose is really quite valuable. And I think that's when you when you have a dragon, if you're going to live in cooperation with that dragon, you're literally going to define that purpose and make a difference. Where would you tell somebody today who's apprehensive, and saying some of the best thing you could do would be to face the dragon turn the light on, and proceed forward to do something for good? What would you tell?

Brad Axelrad
Such a good question? I the process first and foremost, is really to find your fear. Because most of the time, it's hidden, we don't know what it is, we think it's something else. So really doing the deep work. And the access into that deep work of finding it can can be many different things. You know, some will use plant medicine, therapy, Vision quests, right? Like anything you can do to put yourself in that situation, to open you up enough to finally get in touch with whatever that hidden aspect is a new, so it's finding it first, then it's about facing it, and having the courage to really tune into it. And to to commune with it. And to get courageous and be brave and recognizing that that's your power, and then using it. So it's fine face in us. So it's interesting what you say. And you know, we we have our voice nowadays. And that's the one thing we all have, like you're saying with technology. We all have this capacity to use our voice for good. And I think of Don Miguel Ruiz in might be the mastery of love. It might not even be the Four Agreements that almost everybody knows. But we want to use our voice and our notes be impeccable with your word which is I think in the or agreements, of course, and our Yeah, and our voice has power. And we want to make sure that we are wielding our voice in a way that is moving things forward and serving things forward. So, you know, being so focused on sharing a message, that's really what this was about, it's find your fear, share your message, that's sort of how it started. And it's really about having the courage to be a messenger. And you know, there are a lot of us out there now, and thankfully, we can hear so much good information. But now when you say having a higher purpose, like you've aligned your business with, I want to speak to that that coin or crypto platform we are building, because it was such a brilliant, brilliant idea. We are essentially going to be mobilizing a list celebrities and influencers and even Joe hanging out on a banjo in Minnesota to create content for good. It was it was a platform, a live streaming platform to have everybody out there raising funds for charities and disaster relief, with full transparency around having insights into money that was raised and where it went. So I pray that somebody build something like that again, and actually use his content for good content for a change content for che was such a cool platform. But something like that, I think would be really, really profound. It's not going to be me building it. But that just came up.

Greg Voisen
I would concur that taking all this energy and redirecting it, finding the right place to put it for good. And humility is an is another big area. Right. And I think you can do this still with tons of humility, and purpose, right? You don't have to be like the star on the stage. You know, like the people that might be listening, going, oh, yeah, look at Greg voice. And yeah, he's done a 11 on her podcast. And he's got Brad on and all that. Forget all that. I'm just a regular guy. Right? that the point is, and I'm going to use this example. Okay, this is a good story. About a year ago, or maybe less, I get contacted by National Geographic. And they said, Hey, we want to have you put on Dan Bittner, the guy that founded the blue zones. And he's written a new cookbook called the Blue Zones, America. I didn't know much about Dan. But I just watched the new Netflix documentary that was just on just four or five nights ago, but living to age 100. It's not just the cookbook, here's the point. He went from being an investigative journalist. Right, where he was traveling around looking at where all these blue zones were and trying to figure out how people are living to 102 actually now creating a Blue Zones, transformational environmental project where he goes into cities, and he gets them to change, all the walk pathways, the bicycle pathways, the things that need to be done to change people's BMI and make people healthier. So the bigger mission wasn't just about finding sanitarians, it was about him creating something where he could actually go and change massive amounts of change. So he went in the city in Minneapolis, near Minneapolis. And he was expecting a BMI change of like two point something percent. And he ended up with three point something 5%, which was like, amazing. And my point is when you have a bigger mission, right, than just finding this antarians it's one thing to find him, it's another thing to use the information you get and then imparted on other people to have them changed their lives. Right. And that is a great message. So you know, look, you you've kept evolving the five dragon concepts. And is there anything new or upcoming programs you want the listeners to know about that are literally, you know, in your pathway right now, or banging on your head and saying, hey, this is what Brad's gonna do, because I think they'd want to know.

Brad Axelrad
Yeah, so I like I'd mentioned I'm getting interviewed on lots of podcasts. And you can find those on the Fisher dragon.com Media tab, and if that's of interest to listen to others really fun to be on this sort of media tour and sort of unexpected media tour, but as I'd mentioned, we've figured out a really cool way to get people on podcasts. And that that to me is is opening up the channels for folks to share their messages. And that's just get me on podcast.com You know, a really clear and what's fun as I get to weave a lot of this dragon, basing your fear sharing Your message stuff into that it's coaching around it, you know, it's media coaching, it's, it's aI coaching, it's a social media coaching, it's in when I say media coaching, it's, it's how to be effective on a podcast, how to be effective on NBC Nightly News, things like that. So that feels like the next opening for me where I'm taking my whole body of work and my life experience, and pouring it into folks so they can get out and share their message far and wide. And that's just really lighting me up right now.

Greg Voisen
Well, the good thing about that is that, you know, you can become like, the media, the CMO, you know, the chief marketing officer to help people figure out how to get their messages out there, whether it's on a podcast or, or it's through social media, or through other channels, which I see that in UFC lit up, you know, you're like, lit up right now around that. And when we go off the air here, I'm gonna give you a gentleman's name, who has the list of every podcast show, and has kind of talked with me about saying the same thing, but I'd rather gift it to you. Because it isn't in my band, it isn't in my bandwidth, right? So if you were to sum up the essence of the work, I get that you're really excited about this. And there's a lot of people listening to this show, that probably want to be on podcasts, and I'm going to just tell them to go contact you and schedule a call. Hit the button, you know, talk with you see where the conversation goes? Because he's, he has this experience. I want the listener to know. And Brad can do this for you. Right. I'm 100% convinced this isn't new to Brad, it's something that's resurfaced for brand. Okay, anybody that could take the Hoffman thing exploded and get all that media attention that you did? You're the best PR guy around, right. So how would you?

Brad Axelrad
That was all self generated to me? I didn't have a publicist. i Yeah, I got myself on LA Times Orange County Register, CBC Radio Canada. Yeah, it's,

Greg Voisen
there's an art to all of this. And there's a structure to it. And there's a way to kind of do it. And no matter what anybody says, the old cliche is, it's kind of not always what you know, but who you know, especially in the PR business, to get through doors to get people on TV shows to get them wherever you need to do, Brad's your guy. So in essence, kind of sum up the work what you'd like people to take away from, how to face your dragons. You know, in in one kind of sentence or a couple of sentences. What would that be? What is the philosophy that you know, we've talked about the shadow we've talked about a lot of things during this podcast, but what might that be?

Brad Axelrad
It's really simple fear as your friend it's, it's Yeah, learn to love your fear, learn to embrace it and not resist just just trust that that beautiful oh my gosh, I'm afraid breathe. You know, the cave we fear to enter holds the treasure we seek Joseph Campbell, like that's one of the most profound quotes I've ever heard. Like, what's your what's your most resisting open up to it? What you're most afraid of open up to it? That is where the gold is the treasures there. So that's it? Well, and

Greg Voisen
I would tell my listeners from many people I've had on the show, but one in particular. Brian Allman, Dr. Brian Allman

Brad Axelrad
and O'Brien Hypno hypnotists, right. Yeah.

Greg Voisen
Yep. Yeah, you do know him. So you got it. He's he. He's an interesting guy. He's went to India, and in search of enlightenment five or six times, and then went on to round all these people. And the one of the Masters of Wisdom said, So Brian, what is your definition of enlightenment? He said, I don't know. He says, that's why I'm here. I want to be enlightened. I love the site. And he said, Well, really, enlightenment is pretty simple. And Brian's listening. And this this guy says, it is 100% acceptance of self. Right? And I say that because the five dragons with the fear revolves around self acceptance. You know, who are you to actually carry this fear? And be afraid as you said, an entering into In the cave with the dragon, right? Because that's where you're going to slay it. And as you know, and I said this when we did the pre interview, I had the blessing of being part of a book called the precipice of life. The lessons learned by living on a mountaineers edge, right, I interviewed all these Mountaineers and in the end, the theory there around the fear of climbing Everest climbing all the highest Seven Summits, whether it was a male or a female, or whatever it was, was they said, you live your life? Most, when you're facing that fear, not when you're going away from that fear. I know that's hard for some people to really comprehend. It's like, you mean, I've gotta go climb Everest at 26,000 feet? To literally face that

Brad Axelrad
fear is I want it is 26,000. Wow. Yeah. Or 24,

Greg Voisen
whatever it is. But, you know, I had the honor of interviewing all these people who had done all these highest peaks on the continents, right. And I'm talking like, 25 of them. But most of them, Brad all said the same thing. If you're not facing that fear, we're talking about fear now. Right? You're not living?

Brad Axelrad
Yes.

Greg Voisen
Right now, I have ever been out there that's contrary it's like, Oh, my God, I need to be safe. I want to be in my wheelhouse. I want to do good but the reality is, that was a big one. Your comment on that just as a kind of an ending note here for this podcast? What would you say?

Brad Axelrad
You know, I come from a semiprofessional motocross racing background, and I think of flow states and how we are most alive in a flow state. And when we're pushing the edge, you know, especially the masculine likes, is most alive, pushing the envelope. So I would say that with the absence of adrenaline addiction, which was something I chase for a long time, you're 100% accurate, that that Cushing, and just being fully alive, that's when of course we're obviously most alive. And I would challenge everybody watching this to go do what you're most afraid of. If it's speaking, lean in exposure therapy is huge. If you're afraid of heights, which I still haven't fully faced that one yet in an airplane or bungee. I will be a little hypocritical and say, go do that, you know? Well, I think

Greg Voisen
I'd say you're absolutely right. And I think the advice you're giving is good. And you know, Brad, as a soul on this planet, from one soul to another, you're a blessing. Thank you, man. And on this day for being on inside personal growth, spending time with our listeners, talking about facing your five Dragons go to the website, it's face your dragon.com. As you all heard, he has a passion for I'm going to just call it PR work. So if you want to get in front of a lot of podcasters click that button for the schedule your free call. Brad, thanks so much for being on.

Brad Axelrad
Thank you, brother. It's an honor. I've been wanting to be on this show for 15 years, so it's really great.

Greg Voisen
Well, we got it done. I only been doing it 17. So we're so there we go. We finally got

Brad Axelrad
Thanks, man.

Greg Voisen
Thanks, man.