Greg Voisen
Well, welcome back to Inside Personal Growth. For another episode again, and joining me from Colorado is Dr. Gil, Gil Kajiki. And his book is Sick, Tired, Untreated and Abandoned. And the subtitle is How the Medical Community Fails Hashimoto's Patients, and How to Get Back your Life Back, I should say how to get your life back. How are you today? That's the big question.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
You know, I'm always good. I just moved to Colorado a year ago from LA. I mean, can you get much better?

Greg Voisen
Well, you were in Pasadena before, is that right? Is that where you were?

Dr. Gil Kajiki
My college that my chiropractic college was in Pasadena, California, and then it actually got moved to Whittier, California. And then I practiced in California for 35 years. And then I'm tying all that a

Greg Voisen
long time. Well, this book is extremely interesting. And for all my listeners that are dealing with Hashimoto, thyroiditis them by right ism, this would be a great thing for you to understand. And Dr. Kojiki approach is really quite interesting. And the way he came about it, and how he started treating his wife that we're going to be talking about here is interesting. Tell our listeners, what's the CFM P stands for behind your aim.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
It stands for Certified Functional Medicine Practitioner.

Greg Voisen
All right. So that's important too, because that's kind of a way that you approach it is as a functional medicine doctor. And so I'm gonna let my listeners know a little bit about you. He's board licensed Doctor of Chiropractic Medicine, and were a DC from Pasadena College of Chiropractic and is a certified functional medicine. As he said, practitioner from the university and holds a bachelor's degree in science from Pasadena College of Chiropractic. He's also completed postgraduate courses in functional blood chemistry, functional endocrinology, and fibroid and integrative detoxification. As he mentioned, he's not in California any longer. He's in Colorado, and he's the founder of Valley thyroid Institute. And for all my listeners, there's two websites that you can reach Dr. Kojiki. One is, you can just do Dr. Kojiki. And that's kojiki.com. There, you also can watch some free videos and get some resources and download some very interesting items that if you have questions about this, you get more access to that. You can also get in at Valley thyroid institute.com. That's another place where you'll be able to access more information about Dr. Kojiki and how he treats his patients. So he really upholds this theory that every patient is unique. And Eric Ford deserves and Devine individualize treatments specific to their needs. And I do remember a study Dr. Kojiki. I think it was done by Kaiser. But the average doctor that people come in to see they get about 12 minutes. And I remember that study, because it's no wonder people are having issues because the doctors don't have time to listen to them.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Right. Yeah, the old days are gone.

Greg Voisen
Yeah. But you do listen, and you take quite pride in listening and finding out what's going on. And what I'd like to do is start this interview off with the books about the story about your wife, Kim, and her battle with Hashimotos thyroiditis. Is that how you say it? Can you speak about cam her journey and how this disease leads you led you want to search for how to treat it as well?

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Sure. Well, as I mentioned, I've been a chiropractor for 36 years. And you know, Kim was a very busy high level executive and human resources work for very big international company would travel the world several times a year for human resources. And she started coming down with symptoms she started with It fatigue and weight gain, some hair loss, digestive issues, insomnia, and I took it to the doctor and the doctors would say, Well, you know, all her lab tests are normal, it's probably just stress, you know, you've got two teenage kids, you got a high stress job, it's probably just stress. So we kind of had to deal with it. I'm a chiropractor. I don't know any different. I fix spines. That's what I do. So I defer to the experts. Well, the symptoms continued over the next two to three years. And they worsened and she got more, she started getting hair loss, and 50 pounds of weight loss and extreme fatigue, went back to the doctor again, they said, all you got epstein barr, but there's no cure for epstein barr, sorry, you know, you're just gonna have to kind of deal with it and just be less stressed. And they continued for about another year or so. So for maybe about three or four years, you had the symptoms, and they would gradually get worse and worse and worse. But these doctors insisted all her tests are normal. So one day, at the end of December, she woke up in a panic attack, she couldn't breathe, she had heart palpitations. And we took her to the ER, the local er, and I'm thinking they're gonna give her some oxygen, she'll be out in a day and everything would be fine. Well, they put her in and admitted her. And this is a week before Christmas, while I had been starting to study functional medicine about probably four or five months before that. And I had done a blood test before she left to the hospital. I happen to get the blood tests back while she was in the hospital. And I said, I know what's wrong. You know how she wrote it. And so I showed her that and the doctor happened to be there at the time. I said, look, she's got how she knows, this is what she has. This is why all her tests have been normal. And she feels lousy. And he says, Yeah, you're right, I see that she doesn't actually want to say great, what do we do? He said, well, we're gonna give her some levothyroxine. And I said, but isn't that a thyroid medication? He says, yes, that's it. But this is an immune system problem. I don't know a lot. But I know enough to know that how she motors is an immune system problem. So why would you treat an immune system problem with a thyroid medication? And his answer to me was, because that's the way we do it in conventional medicine. So he knew it was an autoimmune condition. He also knew that that's just the way it goes. So I knew at that point, I was not going to get any help from conventional medicine. Luckily, she was well enough to leave the hospital, we fired the doctor took her home, and I went on a search at that point. And I contacted all my colleagues, and I've acknowledged them in my book and the Acknowledgement Page, I think it's about five pages in because they helped me understand the mechanism, the Hashimotos, they helped me understand what kind of lab tests to do, how to create a dietary program, what kind of natural supplements to give her. And in about 18 months, I completely got her Hashimotos into remission without any kind of medication. And I realized at that point, she couldn't be the only one that's like this. And so my practice started to slowly gravitate towards functional medicine and away from chiropractic.

Greg Voisen
Well, Gail, as you mentioned, you know, that it was originally a misdiagnosis. And then you were the one that did the blood tests that show that it was Hashimotos. Obviously, he looked at the blood test, he agreed, right? And but then he went on to say, like, you just said, hey, well, let's this traditional approach versus a functional medicine doctor approach would be to treat her with thyroid medicines, which, as you said, it seemed inane to you, you know, why are you treating this autoimmune condition with, you know, thyroid. And that is one of the things you say in the books is, a lot of these people who will get diagnosed, will be treated with thyroid medications, and their conditions don't get that much better. Which leads me to the second question, you know, you talked about a few of the symptoms. And why do you think that this condition goes misdiagnosed in so many different cases? And what is it that if somebody's out there listening after you give us the symptoms, which you gave us a few, but there are a lot more, right? It's a gut reaction. So you've got gastrointestinal issues. You've got all kinds of things going on. Can you do to help people who are listening right now who might be dealing with this? Yeah,

Dr. Gil Kajiki
well, it is really tricky because it's a myriad of symptoms. And I just mentioned a few of those, but the most common ones are weight gain on stubborn weight gain and depression and fatigue and hair loss and digestive issues, insomnia, those are probably the most common symptoms and you know, if your doctor suspects thyroid, then they're going to run some thyroid tests on you to see. But these tests very often come back, quote unquote, normal, because the range that they use is so wide. And the other thing is, the insurance company typically only approves two out of 10 thyroid tests. So they'll miss a really a lot of these thyroid problems, because they're not doing the right testing. They're not doing enough of them, and they're reading them wrong. And so patients often get misdiagnosed for many, many years until they stumble across somebody like me. That's interesting.

Greg Voisen
And you speak about your journey of you know, as you said, becoming a chiropractor, 35 years practicing in the California area, and especially in the part about the specialty and focus as chiropractic biophysics. What does that entail, because that's something that you've done, and that people need to know who are listening who would come to you and get an internet consults. Because that's what you offer your, a lot of your work, just like we're doing here, right now with this podcast, right? You have people from all over the world that call in and talk to you and you know, you get blood tests and you do certain things, so to speak with us what is this biophysics and what is it kind of entail?

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Well, the biophysics is a form of chiropractic, which was my past life as a chiropractor, because I can't do chiropractic remotely or virtually over the phone. So when I did do chiropractic, my background came from a form of chiropractic called chiropractic biophysics, where we use mathematics and science and physics and applied those mathematical models to the spine and come up with an optimal spinal configuration. So when I did physical chiropractic with patients in office, I would use that form of chiropractic. But that did kind of bleed over into my functional medicine where I wanted patients to have an optimal health, I wanted them to have optimal blood test results. And it meant looking at it a different kind of way than that the rest of the industry typically looked at blood tests and spinal configuration. So I don't do any more chiropractic, because they do all my consultations remotely now. So I don't do any more chiropractic. But that's the background that came from when I refer to chiropractic biophysics.

Greg Voisen
Well, you really are considered a functional medicine practitioner, right? And for all purposes, there are functional medicine doctors who actually get their degrees in functional medicine. And I know a couple in the Bay Area, which are excellent. And is it that patients come to you, because of the functional medicine practitioner for a lot of variety of reasons is, which is what is this for some people out there listening that maybe don't know what functional medicine is, or a functional medicine practitioner, explain to them what it is, and how your process like we said earlier, 12 minutes in the office isn't going to actually figure out what's going on with somebody because you want to hear their history, you want to know more about him, you're willing to listen to them. And then you're willing to put all the dots together as a functional medicine doctor does and say, look, this, as we know, you've got an emotional, spiritual, physical, all these elements, areas of your health that have to be treated, right. So the mind body spirit kind of approach. Right,

Dr. Gil Kajiki
right. Absolutely. Yes. Yeah. So you know, functional medicine means that we are more looking at the function of the body and what's causing these symptoms. We're not necessarily looking for disease and pathology, conventional medicine looks for disease and pathology, it's very black and white with their life test where their lab tests you either sick or your normal. That's kind of the way things are in conventional medicine. I know well, we know in functional medicine, that there can be degrees of dysfunction, but still not be disease or pathology. So it's an enough dysfunction to make you feel lousy, but your lab tests will come out normal. And so we have a way of looking at functional lab ranges and looking at dysfunction of the adrenal glands, dysfunction of the thyroid gland dysfunction of the immune system, before it becomes a disease process. And that's where really we shine is that we realize the body is in black and white. It's not either diseased or normal. There are degrees of dysfunction and we work in the area of that dysfunction where we want to improve and optimize body function to get rid of this symptomatic experiences that you are experiencing as a patient.

Greg Voisen
Yeah. And you know, much of that guilt is associated with emotional issues. I mean, you talked about stress and Kim. Sure. I mean, she was completely stressed out, and she had a high powered job. And you had two kids, and I remember the story. And obviously, women are trying to juggle a lot in today's world. And we have a lot of women listeners, you know, is there a biased for this Hashimotos disease, one meaning toward the sexes and to have these issues that you're treating? How much of the alternative medicine, which to me would be, hey, you know, go to a yoga class, do meditation, find an exercise that you like, hike in the mountains, go outside, be with nature, you know, journal, have a gratitude thing, how much of that kind of process is built into what you're actually advising patients with? Hashimotos?

Dr. Gil Kajiki
All right, well, it is very unfair. But nine out of 10 of low thyroid cases are involved women, just the numbers, just a statistic, I don't know why that is. But if you get 1010 thyroid cases, it's typically nine out of 10 are women. And with Hashimotos, 80% of those low thyroid cases are also women in autoimmune in nature. So we're dealing with an autoimmune condition and a low thyroid condition. Now regarding natural medicine, I break it up into four major categories. So I know every patient that I get has some degree of emotional psychological situations going on physical, neurological, or metabolic nutritional. Everything fits into those four categories. My specialty is metabolic nutritional, because I'm a functional medicine doctor, that's why I can do all this virtually and remotely from any country in the world. But also, because of my chiropractic background, I've got a very strong background in physical and neurological. So I look for those three main areas to see how much of their condition is neurological, physical, metabolic, nutritional, whatever is left over, whatever we can't get resolved or improved is probably emotional, psychological. And I'm not really qualified to work with that. But I can advise them on getting out in nature and doing yoga and meditating and taking time for yourself. But those are all things that we kind of know. But unfortunately, you can't take a hike in nature every day, and it will resolve your Hashimotos. Yeah, so work that way.

Greg Voisen
So speaking of that, you know, you're saying there is more propensity toward female for this particular diagnosis. And I've also noticed that across the board, you know, you were a chiropractic chiropractor. And I had a friend the other day, who was a chiropractor, and we were at lunch with another gentleman, and he says that he was having neuropathy and his feet. And he said, we’ll do Gemini one C test to see. And, and then he said, well, did you ever have any injuries to your back? So my question for you, this is where I'm going with this is, do any of these people have sciatic issues which revolve or come up or back issues, which potentially compressed the nerves in the body, which then made some of the organs not function, the way they should have functioned? Because you know, when you see D, he asked a really good question. He said, have you ever had a laminectomy? And the guy said, Yeah, I had a, what was it? I don't know, Disc four, six, or seven, or whatever was compressing, they did a surgery. And he said, well, you know, your neuropathy could be associated with that particular server surgery. And have you talked about doing something with decompression? And so my question is, with these women are coming in, who potentially have back issues or complaints about pain or sciatic, do you find a higher propensity of people who are dealing with those interest issues, and also Hashimotos disease?

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Actually, I do, but I really find out about that down the line. I mean, as a chiropractor, I dealt with sciatica and headaches and neck pain and back pain and shoulder pain. I dealt with all the pains. And I would use my hands and physical modalities to get those conditions resolved and I was very successful at it. What I didn't realize though, is that when I went into functional medicine, and I started addressing inflammation issues, and thyroid and adrenal and issues and food sensitivities that a lot of these physical conditions these people had would start to resolve. They would say, you know, I never told you this, but I had sciatica because I didn't think it had anything to do with my thyroid. So I didn't tell you about it. But my sciatica is gone. My headaches are gone, my migraines are gone, my neck pain is gone. And they didn't tell me that in the beginning, because they thought it had nothing to do with their Hashimotos her thyroid. So it just, incidentally, went away. Now what that made me realize is way back then, when I was a chiropractor, there was some inflammatory issues going on, that I could have probably gotten resolved. If I had just given them some fish oils, or some turmeric, or some resveratrol, and did my physical therapy and chiropractic modalities, it would have been just an amazing combination. Yeah.

Greg Voisen
And on that line, you know, you said in the book that patients often only tell the doctor what they want to hear, and not necessarily what is really going on with them on a day to day. So that that does basically what you just said just now that's like, hey, they didn't tell the whole truth. And I mentioned that treating your wife gave you a new perspective. Why was this so important in treating Hashimotos disease? Obviously, because she is your wife, you have a lot more insight than you would for somebody who comes in for 20 minutes, right? Or half an hour or an hour or whatever it may be?

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Yeah, yeah. Because I, I work with mostly women. And I talked to them from a doctor that's outside or their house. And I talked to them about what's going on with them. Every so often, I'll be able to get a spouse or a husband or supportive partner involved. And they will start to tell me things that they the wife or girlfriend didn't even realize what's happening. And they would say to me, what did you tell the doctor that you also have these mood moody issues? And they would say, no, I don't? And they will say yes, you do. You just didn't realize that. So I what I realized this being so close to my wife in the house, and being the doctor inside the house, I knew things about her that an outside doctor may not have ever known. And so that gave me some good insight. When I'm treating these women outside their house, I'm thinking maybe there's more going on to this is what they're telling me. And I should try to get that spouse involved. So I've tried to get that spouse or partner involved every single time because they will inevitably give me some golden nugget of information that that patient didn't tell me.

Greg Voisen
That is really quite an epiphany. Because not many people have their spouses go in with them when they're being treated. And I think that's important because they're bringing a different perspective about the person to the table. And then your wife story she tells in the book, she states that she had adrenal fatigue, leaky got night sweats. How did you treat these conditions? And

Dr. Gil Kajiki
what are some of the ways you can test individuals that you think will have that have these symptoms and determine if they have Hashimotos thyroiditis, while determining whether or not you have Hashimotos thyroiditis is, is a simple blood test. There are two different tests that you can use. One's called anti thyroid peroxidase. The other one's called anti thyroid globulin. If those are positive, either one they are positive for Hashimotos at the point so at that point, you know now you're dealing with an immune system issue, not so much of a thyroid issue. Now with Kim's adrenal issues and leaky gut, there are many ways to treat adrenal issues. So you know, I individual individualized treatment for each and every person so I used a six sample salivary tests to test for Kim's adrenal fatigue. And, and that tests you for adrenal gland dysfunction, adrenal fatigue, cortisol rhythms, cortisol levels and HPA axis. So depending upon what kind of adrenal dysfunction we'll find, we will treat them accordingly. There could be five other people who have adrenal fatigue, and we will treat them completely differently. So the symptoms and the test results will all determine how we treat that particular condition whether it's adrenal fatigue, leaky gut Hashimotos, food sensitivities, anemia, as whatever it is. So it's very, very individualized.

Greg Voisen
Well, as a functional medicine practitioner, you obviously now have the background and understanding plus you build a network of other functional medicine doctors and practitioners that you can call upon when you come to this. Yes. And, and I really appreciate the fact that there's been an evolutionary trend in treating people Going through functional medicine, physicians and practitioners, because as you said way earlier in this podcast, you know, the old way is kind of out. You know, it, there are other ways to treat these. And we are beginning to realize that as a society as well, you know, it isn't like, hey, every drug commercial that comes on says, oh, boy, I have that problem, let's go down and get a bill. I mean, the drug manufacturers would like for you to believe that, you know, if you have x, just take a pill, and it's gonna go away. And they're in the business of selling drugs, but probably 80% of the stuff that people watch on TV and see these drug ads, could be treated through diet, through proper nutrition, through exercise, through meditation, through alternative means that people like yourself are recommending, you mentioned that so many people with autoimmune conditions are not properly diagnosed, and they feel that they are a problem. Not that it's that they're the problem, not the condition. How do you work with patients to really get to the root cause of their disease? If they come in saying, you know, I'm the problem? Not that because they don't have to leave that there's their hits them.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
You know, you're right, I think because they've been so tainted with their past experiences, of going to doctors, conventional medicine, doctors, particularly saying, all your tests are normal, there's nothing wrong with you, maybe you need an antidepressant. And they've gone through doctor after doctor after doctor with them telling them, the tests are normal, this, this is probably you, it's probably in your head, you're exaggerating it, you're you know, you don't really have this, you just think you do. And so they are really just very beat up by the time they get to me, and they want to see, show me something that tells me it's not me, it's not in my head. And so when I finally do different kinds of tasks, I do salivary tests and stool tests that they've never had done before. And I show them the evidence that, hey, you really do have adrenal dysfunction, you really do have inflammatory markers, you really do have an autoimmune condition. Now they can start to believe Oh, my gosh, it's a condition. It's treatable. It's not just me.

Greg Voisen
Yeah, so important. And along that line, you said that your wife's disease taught you to become a better doctor. And in this case, because the husband wife, a better listener, not always finding solutions, because she wasn't always looking for a solution. She even said that, and you said it in the book, which, you know, as the male species, we're always trying to find a solution and fix something. Right? Yeah. Why, in your estimation, is it so important for patients to tell their stories? And what is it that you learn so that you can treat them more effectively? When you allow them to tell the stories? Yeah, you know, I,

Dr. Gil Kajiki
I can tell you a very common reason patients give me about poor success with other doctors is they would say, they don't listen to me. They just don't listen to me. And so I do probably 10% talking and 90% listening on my consultations, I'll ask a question, and I just want to hear them spew it out. Because you'll get that information that you need. But you got to let them tell their story. And letting them tell their story, even though, you know, you might find as the male and as the doctor 90% of it, is it applicable, but that little 10% that is applicable, that you have to be patient and listen to them. That's golden. Because now they're telling you what's really important to them.

Greg Voisen
It's, it's, it's a good point you make and I think for all of my listeners who have gone down the path of maybe a traditional medicine, that maybe they should seriously consider a functional medicine practitioner or functional medicine doctor, or anything that's alternative to what they've been doing. You know, you said you look for nine triggers. What are they? And what are the steps to take to diagnose that disease? There’re nine triggers. What are those? If you had them in the book, then you don't have to list all nine. But if you know the nine, let's tell people out there who are listening. You know if you have any of these, you probably should get on the internet and get the free information that Dr. Kojiki has put up there and read it and then email him for a consultation. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. So

Dr. Gil Kajiki
I've called I've coined the term triggers every everybody uses that these days. But triggers in my definition are body dysfunctions that very closely mimic a thyroid problem but isn't a thyroid problem. So these triggers, they look like a thyroid problem, act like a thyroid problem feels like a thyroid problem have the same symptoms that are promised not if I promise trigger. So these poor patients, they're taking their thyroid medication, all the lab tests are normal, but they still feel lousy. So now at that point, what I look for is anemia, blood sugar instability, adrenal gland dysfunction, hormone imbalance, inflammation, gastrointestinal problems, food sensitivities, chemical sensitivities, and hidden infections. There is nobody on this planet that doesn't have some degree of those triggers. And that is typically the root cause of their problem.

Greg Voisen
So question for you. And this is not an off the wall question, but maybe not so off the wall. You know, I know that one of our biggest organs is our skin. Yeah. And my question for you would be when people are starting to experience like, dry skin, or eczema, or any other skin condition. What for you? Is that? Is that a sign that something could be going on as well, I recognize that there are dermatologists that treat this. Okay, I get that. But I also know that, you know, there could be other things.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Right? Right. So as a functional medicine doctor, I typically know that if there's a skin condition, it's not coming from the outside, in, it's coming from the inside out. And so the skin is a is a gigantic detoxification organ. It also reflects when there's low thyroid hormone, it also reflects when maybe there's some fungal or Candida infections. So I look at more of these triggers that are causing the skin conditions, not what is the skin condition.

Greg Voisen
Interesting. Okay, so did you do a wonderful job in that book, and I'm gonna put it up for the listeners. So get yourself a copy, you can go on Amazon, we'll put a link to Amazon to get this book, hey, look, this is a short little book, you can read this pretty quick. And by the way, the type is, is big as well. So he made it easy for you to read and easy for you to get through. This is one of those books you can read on the on an hour long plane flight. So because of all of this, the story, you tell your waist story associated conditions. You tell lots of success stories in the book. And there are people that have kind of written in their box in the book, you know, here's my success story. What advice do you have for someone listening, that might suspect that Hashimotos? Is what they have? And what is then how can you help them affect their health and vitality? Because that's what they're looking for. In other words, okay, your Hey, I have these symptoms. I realize it might be Hashimotos, maybe I haven't diagnosed yet, or there is a listener right now, who knows it's Hashimotos. But it's going to a conventional doctor right now getting treated. Nothing's happening because they're on thyroid medicine working. Right? Would you tell them? Yeah.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Well, this is a very frustrating stage for Pete patients, because they vote they've typically been to doctor after doctor after doctor many years. And they want to know, what do I do? What kind of diet do I have? What kind of supplement do I take? And because it's individualized care, I can't tell you what to do until I know what's wrong. Even saying I have Hashimotos. That doesn't tell me what's wrong, because those triggers that I mentioned, are with agitate that Hashimotos, causing that Hashimotos to attack that thyroid gland. So I have to figure out which of those triggers Do you likely have? I'll match that up with your patient history. I'll determine what kind of lab tests that I need to do to find what kind of trigger you have. And then when I confirm that trigger through the lab tests, now I can create a natural protocol with vitamins, herbs, minerals, enzymes, detoxes lifestyle changes, the inflammatory eating plans to start resolving those triggers. So your first step as a patient is, let's find a doctor who understands what these triggers are. And who can do this kinds of testing that I mentioned in the book so they can get to the root cause they could find out what's wrong first, before they can figure out what to do.

Greg Voisen
Well, we're going to direct everybody to Dr. kojiki.com, which is where you can actually get some free information. You also can book a console there as well. You can also book a console, that valley thyroid institute.com, which is another place that will direct them. Or you can go get this book and read it. And if you believe that there are symptoms you're having, and this book is speaking directly to you, then you're going to want to go back to the website and book something with Dr. Kojiki. Gil, it has been a pleasure having you on insight, personal growth, speaking about the book, speaking about Hashimotos, how it's been misdiagnosed and mistreated. And how a conventional doctor medicine, nothing against them, probably doesn't do as well at treating this disease as a functional medicine practitioner like yourself. Right? So my kudos to you for helping a lot of people. Because when these people get this book, they're going to see that you have helped a lot of people deal with this disease. Question for you, I know everybody's treatment is different, right? And everybody's length, the time for this to reside and go away is different. I know you can't say to somebody out there today, if they haven't diagnosed it. In three months, it'll be gone. What you can say, is what would you tell them? What I can say is

Dr. Gil Kajiki
that with my protocols, you just want to know, are you on the right track. And I would say that, at around six to eight weeks, if you're feeling noticeably better, you know, you're on the right track, you're facing the right direction, you're on the right road, it's just a matter of keep on going to get more improvement. If you feel no change at all, then it's time to reconsider, hey, either I'm not doing the protocols, right? Or you're not following the protocols, right. But there's something going on that I can tell you that on the average, my average patient gives me a report back that they're feeling noticeably better in about six to eight weeks. So it breaks my heart when people say I've been with the same doctrine for three years, and I have no improvement. I've been on the same doctor for a year, I have no improvement. That's way too long to be with somebody for no improvement.

Greg Voisen
Well, one of the things you and I know in the world in which we live today it and I know that's why you love Colorado more than you did. Los Angeles area is that the increased speed at which we move as a society and individuals. It really exacerbates the stress. Yeah, we live in a society where we're not getting as much time alone. We're not getting as much time walking in the woods. For the most part, my for some of you out there listening. We're not getting as much time to meditate or contemplate or do the things that we want to do. Because our lives most people's lives are very busy. You know, they're busy like you you're a practitioner, you're out there trying to help people. And what I would say is for the listeners today that it can be that can trigger what Gil has been talking about here. Listen to this read the story about Kim Kim's was probably triggered by and I want to see if it gets you to agree. high degrees of stress that she was under for a long extended period of time, which we all know can manifest in many different diseases. It can manifest in high blood pressure, it can manifest in heart disease, it can manifest in all kinds of things. But it also can manifest in Hashimotos.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Right. So it's definitely a trigger for start to get off. Yeah. Yeah,

Greg Voisen
really is. So Gil, thanks for being on. Here's the book. Everybody, go out and get it. Thanks for listening to Dr. Kojiki. And myself speak about his new book. We'll put links to Amazon. We'll put links to the website. I appreciate you, Gil. Thanks for your time today.

Dr. Gil Kajiki
Thank you so much, Greg.