Welcome back to Inside personal growth. This is Greg Voisen, the host of the podcast, Jill. Everybody knows me because they listen to this podcast, but they don't know you joining us from Eugene or again, is the author of this book, guidance from the useful universe, hopeful messages for everyday challenges. Jill. Amy Sager, Jill, thank you for being on the show.

How you doing? Thank you for having me. Well, it's a pleasure,

and I'm glad that we were able to connect get this podcast booked, and for all my listeners, you're in for a treat. I'm going to let them know a tad bit about you. Jill, she says in her website she's a Jewish woman, disabled since birth, who grew up in the Bronx, now living in Eugene, Oregon. I spent many childhood years in and out of hospitals, and for much of your adult life, you were depressed, lacking self esteem and believing that you are unlovable. The profound teachings from the taro and guidance the universe for wisdom I channel helped you to blossom into self confident woman that you are today. This is why you help others and have been helped. This is your first book, correct?

Yes, yes. This is my first book on this subject. I actually used to be a professional percussionist, and I have a curriculum book out there, but that was a long time ago, but I won't, right, and hopefully the other other books in the future. Well,

you said, you told the people at your website you received your first set of taro cards as a gift in 1970 Yeah, today that you're sought after, share with an international following and she what you've learned to continue through reading the taro and understanding the higher powers is a gift that she's giving all of us today in this podcast and guidance from the universe. So Jill, thank you. Thank you again for being on the show and taking this time to talk about your new book and to provide our listeners with some insights. So you told there was a little bit I told about your story. Look, you were in and out of hospitals for years. You didn't feel loved. You didn't think you were lovable. You said, obviously, those are key emotional and psychological things that are going on, was there a pivotal moment that you realized you needed to share this wisdom, and in particular, you know through this book that you've been able to give to our listeners.

I actually didn't even know I was going to be writing this book. What happened? I guess the pivotal moment was after I had downloaded automatic writing through automatic writing. At that time, these messages from the universe that were so loving and wise on all these different topics, suffering and judgment and jealousy, I was really blown away, and they were helping me, and years later, I'm laughing, because I still think this is funny, that voice that I get that is what I call this universal love messages. I heard them. They said to me, did you think that these messages were only meant for you. And I was like, yeah, thank you. They've been great for me, and I certainly have shared them with my clients, but the message came through that really more people needed to have these and that's when I started to write the book. It was only later that I came up with the idea to write my stories, and I have to say, I've had my intuition, personal intuition, has grown over the years, working with taro and, you know, initially, and trusting my own intuition and something, something said to me myself. I thought, you know, I'm going to write my own stories. I really didn't analyze why that was, but I did, and so in this book, I have my own stories about how I use the information, and then later, I also got the message I was actually in New York visiting my family when I realized that I probably need to put in questions to jump start the reader's own musings on these topics. And so the book evolved slowly, but in that way, yeah,

the questions are really I was just on with somebody who is a fellow podcaster and an author, and the book, interestingly enough, was about 68 questions that he came up with. And I think, you know, questions for a podcaster, people think, Oh, it must be easy. Well, it's not always easy, but the reality is, it is the questions that are engaging and provoking deep thought that really give the listeners a better idea. Now, your book covers a wide range of topics, from emotions to spirituality, in your estimation. Jill, what unites all of these lessons, and what do you hope the readers are gonna take away from this?

I think for me, what unites all of this, and I get a little teary eyed when I talk about it, is that awareness is all, and that's actually my first chapter, and that's a message that I got from the universe, and I have really come to understand that in a very profound and big way. And what I mean about awareness is all is that putting a mirror on myself, seeing myself truly as I am, is such a freeing thing, like I'll give you an example, and I think I remember this is in the book, if I if I'm at a stoplight and I am fuming, and this happened to me, and I'm fuming at the person in front of me because they didn't use the intern signal whatever was going on that day. And I remember being at that light, and I remember feeling all of this pent up anger and frustration. And and, you know that road rage feeling it was terrible, and I, because I've been practicing this idea of awareness and self responsibility, I I noticed what was happening inside of me, the suffering that I was actually feeling through that anger and that pent up energy, and I took a breath and I let it go, and immediately, and this is through years of working with this, this didn't happen. I say immediately. It did immediately happen that I felt more compassion, which took me years to understand that too. But it did happen in that moment, the compassion just flooded in. I immediately thought, gosh, maybe it's a new driver. Maybe their turn signal doesn't work. And I was able to let go. And what I have felt from, from that awareness, which is I really believe is what, what we what we need to be doing to uplift our lives. Self Awareness is that I absolutely in that moment, and I still believe this, I do better for myself when I'm one with me, when I am more in tune with myself, when I am not struggling and and then, and then I know that I can do better for other people. That's when I'm at my best to do to be kinder to people, to be gentler with people. And I also believe that the world needs this. You know, why am I adding? And that that was the other thought I had that day in my car. Why am I adding more of that energy, that anger, into the world? We don't need it. So it really is this all encompassing idea, I think, for me, and what I've learned from the universe's messages, that really self reflection, self awareness, is so important if we're going to feel better in life's awareness better.

You know, as I think many of the listeners know it's it's easier to say that they are self aware. It's challenging to control that emotion of anger, frustration or whatever, in the moment. And as you said, you took a deep breath. And I think awareness comes in many ways, and one of the ways that it does is through taking a breath before you actually spout off or you say something you don't you would have regretted saying in the moment, because you just felt like you had to say it. And you have some other key themes and concepts in the book. One of them is surrender, and the other one is you write about fear and forgiveness, and I think I'm going to combine this question, because intuition is what guides you. But how can people learn to move past the fear and embrace forgiveness in their lives. And how can people, and we can double up on this one, how can people let go and detach from what they think is right, the way it should go, and versus being attached to something, which is this is an Eastern philosophy frequently, then being disappointed that it didn't happen a certain way, not getting the love they wanted, not getting the money they thought they deserved, not getting the house that they thought they were supposed to have. So it's kind of a combined question for you, but I think that both of them kind of they feed off of one another.

Well, I think the underbelly of what you're talking about has to do with suffering, really, and when we attach, I mean, it's human nature. I do this too. We want to be secure, we want to control. We want things to work out. And we sometimes believe, mostly, perhaps, believe that we, if we hold on and keep following the same course, or, you know, things, things will work out, we have control, etc. But what I see over and over, and what I've seen in my own life is how, if I'm holding on to something tightly and it's, and I see it's not quite working out. It's a little bit the energy on that can be a little bit like, you know, hitting your head against a wall. And I think that it is hard, difficult to let go and let be what is, what's meant to be. And that is, that is a very, I think challenging thing to do, but I also have seen for myself and with clients that when I let go, I end up being able to see people for who they are, allow for whatever is meant to be, and it is freeing To be in that space, and I think it takes a lot of courage to let go and to allow for what is and to surrender that's it's not an easy thing to do, but I did.

You did you grow up in the Jewish faith?

I did, but not what, what we call, perhaps a cultural Jew. In other words, we did all the holidays. We did go to temple, but I my Jewish upbringing, definitely, I think, has informed the fact that I am able to question it might have, even when I've thought about it, it might have even informed the fact that I said yes to Taro, and so

did you. So did you get into Jewish mysticism?

No, I never did. But

any of that, no, no, never did.

But the reason I'm thinking that it might have informed my ability to say yes to all of this that has happened to me, which really was a surprise to me and unexpected. I never thought I was going to be a taro reader or a go between for spirit. But in the Jewish religion, we are taught to question. We're critical thinkers. We're taught to question. It's not a dogma. And so I think when these things started to happen, I felt open to and maybe because of my background and my upbringing, I felt open to just acceptance and going, Okay, I'm not going to I'm not going to put this in a box. I'm not going to say this doesn't exist. I'm going to continue to say yes to it and to ask, you know, what is it, and what can I learn from it, and what can I offer myself through it? You know,

how did you end up taking this self discovery through Taro? And then, why did you believe that the taro itself would be a personal, uh, transform, transformational process for the way you helped others.

Well, when I moved from from the Bronx to California in the 70s, late 70s, I met a woman who gave me a taro reading. At that time. I had no idea what that was, and taro certainly wasn't as popular as it is today, but immediately I felt like the cards knew me, that I was being seen. I remember, I don't remember what that first reading was, but I certainly remember that it was helpful, and that's what Taro is. It really is about knowing thyself. And so the next day, she gave me a set of cards, and I started to study, you know, I'd study, I just really took to it. And it was through that process of learning the cards and becoming more intuitive myself, because of using the cards, starting to read for others, just because word of mouth was spreading. My sister was telling all her friends, and I ended up years later. And I think because I was a musician, I think because I had a creative that right side of the brain, you know, the intuitive, creative side, I ended up, yeah, getting this information and from the universe, and it's all kind of come together. I mean, when I work with clients today, I still am pulling cards. I love Taro, but I certainly am getting information from the universe. And what I notice is that it's all the same stuff. What I say in the preface of my book isn't that, what I'm saying is new. It just might be a new way of understanding it. We are all, all of us, I believe that are in this genre of whatever you want to call it, self help, metaphysical, being able to understand what's going on, you know, what's behind the veil, using Taro, using oracle cards, whatever it is, I really, really believe it's, it's simply put, it's love, and it's there to help us, to pull us out of suffering. And there are many different ways that we can do this. And My way is one way, and I do offer my way, obviously, to clients at this point only because I am myself. You know, work in the program air quotes. I continue to learn. I continue to check myself. I suffer. Right before we met today, I meditated for 15 minutes, I've been having a little bit of a sad time. That's okay, that happens. But part of what self awareness is about, it's truly about acceptance. It's truly about acceptance. It's not about judging ourselves. It's about acceptance. And that is something that is such a gift to

Well, I think it's, it's learning how to, you say, self acceptance, but it's learning how to understand that this is what is. And you know you do have, as you said, you have choices, you have gratitude that you mentioned in the book. But I want to talk about people that kind of feel lost or maybe stuck, and they're looking for their seeking and and a lot of people like you just said, Oh, well, 15 minutes before this, I did this because I was feeling a little despondent, right? But they feel disconnected or lost in in this world, because it's hard to attach to something that's permanent. It seems shifting all the time. There's uncertainty in every part of our worlds today. And I'm not just going to blame it on the government. I'm going to say we have we live in in a pretty fast paced world these days, from what I remember and perceived before. How can they reconnect with the wisdom of the universe, which is what you're offering, and live the more aligned life? They obviously can come to you and have a taro reading. They can pick up your book and get ideas from this book. Do you have any ideas about how they might like stop right now and say, Okay, I should, I should basically deep breathe and do a meditation, or I should take a walk in the woods, or I should go down to the beach, or I should do something, but something that removes their mind from going in that proverbial circle of what ifs, yeah,

that's a really good question. I actually worked with a client yesterday on that, on that what if thing, you know, she was overwhelmed. I really believe that, and this is, you know, what I've learned, and what I have noticed is that we do spend a lot of time as humans. This is so normal. We are disconnected, right? Our view is outside. In other words, life challenges us. It always will. That's not new. Struggling, suffering is not new. This is what happens to us. And when that happens, as you said, we are we're kind of in that place where maybe all we can see or all we can feel is that suffering and that challenging, and it can be overwhelming, and that's exactly what happens to us. That's exactly where we get caught. And really, I know this is going to sound counter intuitive, but this is what guidance has taught me, and this is what I absolutely believe, because I have done this for myself, we suffer as humans, and yet we don't spend time really, really, you asked earlier about emotions. We really don't spend a lot of time sitting with the suffering. We know we're suffering, but we're busy. We do this. We do that. You don't even have to take a walk in the woods, really, if we sit

down. Do you think that people don't sit in the suffering Jill because they really don't want to hear what the suffering has to say or what they're trying to learn from it?

I don't know. But I mean, we are all so busy. And like I said, I think it's counter intuitive, because I know from working with clients, when I say, if you sit in the suffering, and you absolutely just turn on a, you know, put a timer on for five minutes, 10 minutes, sit in the suffering, it's at your suffering anyway. It's not going to get worse. I mean, this is our fear. I think we think if we sit with it, it'll never go away. We'll drown in it. We're already suffering. It's already happening. I mean, I'll give you an example. The first time I tried this mindful meditation my teacher, Amy trazona, is wonderful. Mindful meditation teacher, years ago, and I remember sitting timer 10 minutes I was feeling just terrible. I don't know what was going on. I don't remember. It doesn't matter. And I sat, I thought, I can feel that I'm not happy. I can feel that something's going on for me, and I already okay. I already come from, as we've discussed already, this idea that awareness is very important. So I was willing to sit for those 1015, minutes. What I noticed was that I was so anxious. My body was buzzing. I felt like I was over across the room noticing that brought me back. It's like, why would I do that to myself? I don't think we can really lie to ourselves. I don't think we really, I think it's just about sitting with whatever's going on that's simple. It's not about clearing your mind or trying to will it away. Guidance has taught me, and I do this all the time for myself, that if I I'm suffering anyway, and I'm over saying this, but I really, I see it working, and that's why I said it's counterintuitive. We really feel like we're not going to be resilient. We really believe if we sit with the suffering, as I said, it'll grow no if we sit with it, it's like we're struggling. We notice that we're struggling with ourselves, that this fight isn't about the challenges that are taking us. It's about the choices we're making, about how we're dealing with those challenges. And in that moment, even if I'm relieved for 10 seconds because I breathe and I went, Wait, I don't want to feel all this pain inside of me. That's 10 seconds of relief, that's everything. So as we do that and practice that, what I've noticed is that I get better at at noticing it, right, quicker, right? And, you know, I used to be, you talked about, you know, I was depressed for many years. And, you know, people take medication for that. I have no judgment on that. But when I went to the universe and I said, What should I do? I wake up unhappy every morning with the weight of the world on me, with the weight of my own self, hate on me, my own discomfort with myself, etc, and and I said, Should I take drugs? And the universe said, you'll find another way. Now, I don't do everything. The universe always tells me it's gotta resonate with me. Nobody's the boss of me. I'm not the guru or the boss of anybody else. This is, you know, I'm just helping others to help themselves, right? And that's how I feel about the universe. But I really did sit with that and they were right, and the way that I learned to help myself was as we already

this way, this way,

that's right to really be myself.

My question would be from for you, what has been bubbling up with me as you've been speaking, and thank you for that explanation. The question that I asked is truly, what has the universe guidance. Told you, our guidance from the universe regarding impermanence.

Oh gosh. What do you mean by impermanence? Is that I could

say finitude, impermanence, our fiscal being here on this fiscal plane, moving to an another plane of existence. What? What kind of download, if any, have you received regarding because, look, it's something that a lot of people fear, depending, I mean impermanence of even the house, the car, the money, the relationships, whatever it might be, or also the impermanence of actually being, physically, fiscally, here on this planet. Yeah,

well, you know, let me talk first about the fact that, you know, part of what I've learned has to do with what's here right now. You know, I mean, and that's, you know, when you talk about the fear of losing things or whatever, I mean, sometimes it's just a matter of saying, Am I okay, you know, in this moment, I am still here in this moment. Have gratitude just, just for that, because we, we don't know how long we're going to be here, right? So really, is about this, this struggle, this human struggle that we have about, you know, the the future and the what ifs and being overwhelmed by our choices, and yet, right here I am, you know, right here in this moment, I'm here, and when I can get to that, everything shifts, and I'm just grateful. And when I've, I have asked the universe, I do have a chapter in my book about death. I believe I remember that. And I when I've, you know people, some clients have come to me and they've asked, and it's always the same answer. I always get the same answer, which is, you know something. I don't think you have to be someone who channels information to know this, but that's a level playing field we're all heading there. Nobody's getting out of this world alive. And in that way, when I think about that, even though I have, I have a fear of death or what does that mean, and where am I going to go when I realize that it's everybody's experience. It really does settle that fear. I want to believe that just like being born is such a gift, that for me, this is my own belief, my own bias, that dying is a gift. When I asked about reincarnation, and I talk about this in my book, I believe I've had past lives. But I'm here to tell you that I live in the wonder of all of this. I don't have definitive ideas. Guidance never gives me definitive ideas about what the other side is. It could be that the other side has to do with how we believe it's going to be I have no idea, even I who have noticed that I might have had, you know, and I say, might have had past lives, still, I cannot for myself. This is just me. Totally buy into it because I don't know. I really don't know, and I it's

fair, and I think many people don't know, and we don't know they, I think they, they are seeking to find something thus all the great religions of the world that are supposed to be giving them some silence in what it might be, or if they do These certain actions. But I will say that, and I want to preface this is, no matter what, pardon me, dogma you might believe in, whether it's, it's Catholicism, or it's Hinduism, or you're a Muslim, or, you know, whatever religion it is, I think you know, look, more religions have removed people from the true source by dividing them from that universal power, this source of guidance for you, than they have done to connect them to it. Yes.

And isn't that Yeah. And I was going to say, isn't that the way, though, that we If love exists, if love exists here and on the other side of the if love exists, then I have to believe that, you know, love exists, whether I'm here or not. I mean, this is, you know what you're talking about, really, that fear of death, this is what you and I are both talking about, that fear. So having to know what it is for me personally, and I can't say this is true for anybody else, but for me personally, why continue to go down that path of fear, whether it's about, you know, when I die or while I'm here, that energy of fear can motivate us, right?

It's a very question, and it's not always just about fear. It's about what is it like? Meaning, what's the experience? And I think the people who believe in reincarnation, that's fine. If you believe in reincarnation, whether you remember your past lives or you're not, that's fine. But I think for a lot of people, they have to realize, and I and I say this with with all due respect, it's hopefully like just taking off an article of clothing, right? Meaning, this has been a great analogy over time. It's like you're just changing suits. You have a suit on while you're here, you can put a new another suit. And I don't really know that. I just know that it, what it does is it helps a lot of people get relief from what they think is actually going to happen because they associate it with pain. Now, is there a lot of pain sometimes before the ultimate event? Yeah, there's a lot of people that have cancer and suffer from all kinds of things and ailments and whatever. And there's other people that go immediately, right? It's just like, boom, you're gone. Or they went to bed and they didn't wake up. The point there being though the the the mind spends lots of different concepts your book and your guidance. So if they did want to come to you and get a reading and that was one of the questions on their mind, you would be able to address that through what the taro might say. But I think this is a wonderful resource for people. That's what I'm going to tell my listeners out there today, is it definitely go pick up a copy of guidance from the universe. It says hopeful messages for everyday challenges. And believe me, finitude is one of those things that a lot of people think about sometimes, thinking about it every day. This is Jill Amy Sager, and she has been on with us for the last 45 minutes discussing this. And when you go into this book, believe me, the pictures of the taro cards are in there as well. So you can see that the deck that she's using a lot of people color them. Actually like to color them in with pencils, but it's very intriguing what you're doing and the way you're going about doing it. And it's also, I think, been quite an eye opener for many of the people that are listening to the podcast today. And I want to thank you for being on the show, I want to thank you for taking some time to really convey your story, your message, the messages you've gotten from guidance from the universe, and some of the other areas that we've gone off onto regarding practical applications and the constant key concepts in the books, is there any one last thing that you'd like to leave the listeners worth, like one key thought, if they were going to go at it right now, what should they be thinking at thinking of,

yeah, you know, when you ask these questions, the only thing when I ask the universe, when I sit and I speak to The Universe. And I ask them whether, no matter what kind of day I'm having, and I say, what do I need to know? The answer always comes back the same love, and what that means for each of us, we have to figure out what that is. But for me, that feeling of love pours through me and I become uplifted. I don't even have to define what it is, but love is always their answer, and I think that siding with love is probably the best way to go, right?

I remember the guy that wrote the book on relationships, men are from Mars, and women are from Venus. And he always used to say, Would you rather be right, or would you rather be in love? And what he meant with couples was all the couples at all the time saying, I'm right, you're wrong, I'm right, you're wrong. Or you just say, No, I'd rather be in love and just accept it for the way that it is. So that's beautiful. Yeah, it it is, because it's always this, you know, kind of retaliation or this dispute that can occur, and what you're saying when you're in loving kindness, when you love yourself, when you love the other people, when you have compassion, when you have understanding, you're going to have a more peaceful, serene existence, versus the constant conflict. Now, there are times we need that conflict in our life, and it's and it's fine, and that chaos in your life, as long as you're growing from it, right? Yeah, it

gets our attention. It gets our attention. But I love what you said. I love what you said that is so true, that is the key, isn't it, that peaceful existence, the belief and the ease of life. And I am only one example that it's possible I have. I was somebody who went from really struggling in life to a life that's a lot more ease. And I do, I do believe it's because of the the messages I received from the universe constantly reminding me that that is my choice. I can you live at ease. It is a choice,

actually, to write a whole book about it, you had to believe that so so. Jill, thank you for being on inside personal growth. Namaste to you. Thanks for sharing your insights and your wisdom from guidance from the universe. We'll certainly put links to your website and links to Amazon to buy the book. It's been an honor and a pleasure having you on the show. Thank

you, Greg. My pleasure.